‘The soldiers need to be heard’ – Ukrainian serviceman shares challenges of warfare in candid interview

"It was easier then. The enemy was not so experienced then," Pinochet compares the situation at the front at the beginning of the war and now. He began his military career with the volunteer battalions and spent the entirety of the full-scale war in the field.

How has the enemy army and its tactics changed over the years? What does the war look like now? And how do men who were forcibly mobilized behave in the unit?

Pinochet, a soldier of the 56th Brigade, spoke with Serhiy Hnezdilov, a fellow serviceman and host of hromadske, in the ++ podcast.

About the experience of service before the all-out war

The volunteer battalions were very motivated. Everything was much simpler: you arrived, you performed certain tasks, and if you got tired, no one held you back. You could go home, rest, and come back if you wanted to.

In 2014, I served in the Cherkasy Battalion, which was formed at the military registration and enlistment office. We had different vehicles, no military equipment at all, and no heavy weapons.

Then we were assigned to the 72nd Mechanized Brigade. In 2016, I resigned, and was at home for a while, resting.

I liked discipline in the army, something that is lacking in society. At home, you constantly see that whoever is the best is in charge, but the army levels it out and puts everyone in their place.

On the beginning of the full-scale invasion

I caught the beginning near the village of Nevelske in Donetsk Oblast. It was clear that something was wrong, because there was this buzz. Before the full-scale invasion, we had already seen enemy planes. There were a lot of enemy drones in the evening and in the morning.

When we entered Velyki Novosilky, we managed to set up a defense thanks to my commander, Yevhen Valeriyovych Kocherha. I saw how he worked, how he calculated all the nuances. And we managed to hold the line. During the entire time we were there, there were fluctuations in the position, plus or minus 100 meters back and forth. But there were no global retreats on our part.

If we compare now and then, I would say that it was easier back then, because the enemy was not as experienced. Indeed, they were throwing this mass of ammo and meat, but they were mostly inexperienced fighters: there were cases when they got up and ran at us full tilt, for some reason, toward our positions.

On the evolution of the Russian troops

Their development is very visible. They also have smart commanders. Three lines of defense were not just something they came up with out of the blue. And yes, they have grown a lot technically.

The problem is that our media are silent about it. Showing and telling the public everything is probably not the right thing to do either, we don't want to scare people, but we need the public to understand that they have a very powerful development.

Now they are looking for weaknesses, and where they see that it is expedient to use a large number of people, they can do so without fear. You have to be able to manage a large number of people. It is not easy.

The enemy should not be underestimated. The enemy is very strong and intelligent, and we can see its development.

On the role of television

I think it's extremely difficult to motivate our side now. How can a fighter who has come from a position and sees what is happening at home motivate himself?

For example, my village neighbor turned on the TV: "All the enemy attacks have been repelled, so much equipment has been burned, a thousand orcs have been killed, everything is fine." He turns on another channel: "Everything goes to the Ukrainian Armed Forces". Why donate? The soldiers are also watching, and their sense of injustice is growing.

Television is a very powerful, driving part of society. To excite society a little bit, we need to show it that it is very difficult for us here.

The support of society is not felt now, only in isolated cases. In general, there is no longer the feeling that used to be there: "Have a combine harvester because you don't have a car."

On the importance of family support

Many women do not understand their husbands. She calls him and says: "This is the third time your neighbor has come on leave, and you have not been once. Don't you want to come see me?" 

Women need to be patient because a soldier who is directly in the trench has a sense of injustice. And his family is the very engine that pushes him to victory. If you love him, you should try to support him in any way you can: reassure him at times, say "I'm here for you" or "If you need me, I'll come." 

Many soldiers, when they return to the rear, live by the principle that everyone owes them. Who owes you what? You have a sense of injustice because you fought and your neighbor did not. You chose one way, he chose another.

On mobilization

I think the true patriots have already volunteered. A certain percentage of people who stayed at home also want justice. And a certain percentage are slaves by nature, I would call them that. They live by the principle: that’s no concern of mine.

Our military recruitment centers need to be given legal authority. Then, of course, we will see how it goes.

Lawyers are now in good demand because people who don't want to go to the army use their services. This is shown on the Internet, it's all in the open.

Our major media should show people the truth to excite society a little bit. Then we will have interesting, strong guys who can do something. As it is, he gets up in the morning, and watches TV – everything is great, he can go fishing or do his own thing. He thinks: "The guys are repelling everything, winning. Why should I bother going there?"

On the fact that war is hard

I think that society in general does not understand what war is like. Even when performing tasks, not every soldier understands. Bam, boom – and everything is normal. When you've already arrived, your instinct for self-preservation kicks in, or fear takes over.

When I was motivating myself, I always kept saying in my head: "No matter what happens, the main thing is to work." I need to control everything – it calms me down.

The enemy is calculating where it is better for it to go, where it will spend less manpower. Of course, there are areas where FPV drones are not used so intensively.

Even during our assault operations, they used FPVs to hit the infantry, which is unthinkable for us, because we save drones for equipment. They have powerful resources, and now I think they are ahead of us. Our guys are working hard, they are good, but there is little development in this area.

There is a very powerful enemy influx where our unit is located.

On draft dodgers and traitors

Where soldiers are recruited, where they are given basic training – we all know what is going on there, that no one knows where to go, what to do. Some people see this and think: "I'm going to go there, and it's like completely..." And then, when they arrive here, we start working and communicating.

In my unit, no one has ever admitted that "I was caught and brought here." I'm sure there are some, but they don't want to talk about it. Their attitude changes immediately because we really try to work hard, take everything into account, and think about our guys – we try to provide everything we can. That's why there are no cases when someone comes and says: "This is not for me" – no, there were no such cases.

I once managed to go on leave for 10 days. On the fifth day already, I wanted to go back, because there was some misunderstanding. Moreover, sometimes they ask inappropriate questions: "Did you kill?", "When will the war end?", "Were there any Javelins?"

I think that those at home have no choice – sooner or later they will have to fight. I just want them to understand this and use the time they have now to prepare – at least pump iron and train their legs and backs.

To those who think they can negotiate with the Russians, I will say: if they go to negotiate, they will be traitors on our side, and automatically in their eyes too.

As I know from my sources, in occupied Zaporizhzhya Oblast, Vladimir Putin issued a decree for people who sided with Russia, including police officers, to be forced into the trenches for three months.

If you betray here, you will betray there. If you have panic, you can make some other contribution to our common victory.

I don't know what kind of negotiations can be held after what they have done.

In our unit, the guys only dream of going on leave. Of course, we try to let the guys go home to get some rest. Some come back, some don't. Of course, we struggle with this, try to bring the man back, get in touch with his family, try to convince him: "My friend, think about your family because there will be consequences – not now, but there will be, and your family will suffer from them first and foremost." 

On respect in his unit

Which country in the world is currently ready for a full-scale invasion? I don't think even America is ready for that either. Probably only Israel was ready, but they have been at war with the Gaza Strip for 20-30 years. They must have had a sense of war, this tension.

It's one thing to fight somewhere in Africa, it's not clear with whom, and it's another to fight at home.

There must be discipline in the army – there is no other way. Of course, there are many nuances, but they are everywhere.

The charter is a good thing, but the commander must earn the respect of the soldiers. If you just wave the charter, I don't think a 45-year-old man will be impressed.

Why did people join the army at 18? Because you can still do something with them, re-educate them, and set them on the path of truth. But here are grown men, and saber-rattling won't earn you respect.

When you do your best to make everything work and don't forget about the soldier, then he develops respect for you and tries not to let you down.

I tell the team that we are one, we have to help each other. I try to explain to my soldiers that "it's not my problem, it's the 21st Battalion's problem" - how can it be my problem? This is our common problem.

It should be like this not only in a separate small unit, but in general. If the guys suffer losses, someone else has to fill the gap.

In my unit, I have repeatedly raised the topic that we should not look for the guilty now, it is better to solve the problem, and then we will think about who did what wrong.

On the need to hear the military

People should not die in the rear, it is enough that they die at the front.

Everyone has relaxed as everything is fine with the military. In reality, it is very difficult because the enemy is constantly evolving. And if we once used to try to outplay it, to be one step ahead, now we are keeping pace.

Society needs to understand that the military needs to be heard. I'm not saying to listen and obey everything, but at least to have respect and let them speak.